Stella Artois...a total disgrace.

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Stella Artois...a total disgrace.

Postby CrazyDiamond » Sun Jun 06, 2004 5:49 am

This is a copy of an e mail I sent to the Stella Artois Organisers.

"It's a disgrace.
The organisers and Draw Committee of your Tournament are clueless.

Please explain to me why 8 so called Top Pro players have a bye in the 1st round of the Main Singles Draw.
Dont bother even offering an explanation,because the explanation is simple stupidity.

You could have given 8 more struggling Pro Players an opportunity to be in the Main Draw,instead of giving the RICH OVERPAYED TOP PRO'S a bye.
What's the problem,you scared some of your top players might be knocked out in the 1st round....good,that's what competition is all about.......why are you protecting them.?

And then I see you've given all the Doubles seeded teams a bye as well......I simply give up,you hav'nt got a clue......wake up or let some young blood take over from your old fools who run your tournament.

I've nothing more to say,your Tournament does nothing to further the popularity of Pro Tennis around the World,in fact it's Officials like you that have been the cause of the drop of popularity of Tennis the world over.

I hope it rains non stop for the entire week."

Thats the way I feel about it.
The ATP and other Pro Tennis Organizations around the world are only interested in the Top Pro Players.
They could'nt give a flying f&*k about the thousands of other Pro Tennis Players who inhabit this planet.
For the ATP it's all about money,how much they can make,how much they can pay the top 30 players,how much they can put in their pockets,that's it.

The ATP is meant to look after the Tennis Pro's...please someone tell me how they are doing it.
If a Pro plays Challengers on a weekly basis,and he reaches the last 8 week after week,he'll make around $ 5000 a month......you can earn that kind of money as a waiter in a resteraunt.....why bother becoming a Pro Tennis player.
Can you imagine that.......a Tennis Player ranked round about 150 in the World,earning $ 5000 a month if he's lucky.
A golfer ranked 500 in the World earns more than that.

GOD help the Pro Tennis Players is all I can say.
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Postby CrazyDiamond » Mon Jun 07, 2004 8:25 am

I see everyone is too scared to make a comment.

What....has no one got anything to say.?
So all is just fine with the ATP Mens Tour,there's nothing to criticise.?

Well then you either dont know the facts,
or you dont know any Professional Players.
or you're simply to ignorant and know nothing about Pro Tennis.

Nevermind.
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Postby R. Jayakrishnan » Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:12 am

Relax, CrazyDiamond. We are with you. Just numb from your tirade, that's all :)

Actually the Queens ATP is not the only ones with first round byes, and it may be unfair to single them out. After all, they are conducting an event with more spots than other tournaments which have only 32 spots. May not be fair to criticize them when they asre offering more spots in the draw, right?

There may also be an argument in favor of the seeded players that they end up playing many more matches in many tournaments. While the lower-ranked players might have lost earlier in the previous week and can get to the next tournmant early to practice and play, the higher ranked ones may have played till friday or saturday in the previous week and have to get to the new place and play immediately without much practice on the courts. Especially so if it is a 64 draw and a first round match cannot be pushed to wednesday anymore (as can be done in the 32 draw events). Not good to penalize suiccess like that.

Perhaps we should have more of 32-draw events turned into 48 draw events with byes, actually.

But I am sure everybody here agree with your sentiment about the tendency to neglect the lower ranked player and just push the big names. More than the draw size or byes, the real problem is in ATP's and tournaments' publicity work, where they act like these guys ranked near 100 or below (what, eve3n players ranked below top-50) are not great players.. Tennis will not improve unless ATP comes up with strategies to tell the casual public that the depth in tennis is tremendous and that a match between two top-75 players is very nearly as good as between two top-35 players, to watch. Also that some of these top-100 players are worth closely following because many have what it takes to crash into top-10 any time...

Jay
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Postby Steve G » Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:28 am

I believe we've had our first rant on the new boards. ;-)

:rant:
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Postby CrazyDiamond » Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:50 am

I've been dying to rant for years,thankGOD I've found a Tennis Forum to do it........I normally spend all my time on the Guitar forums.

I've been watching this ATP in-efficiency for years now,and nothing ever changes....it just stays the same year after year.

It's sad.......it's a pity I've got a family member who's a Pro,so I have to continually be reminded of the ridiculous way the Pro Tennis Tour is run.

Look at the Doubles situation.
It took some players years to get their Doubles Rankings into the Top 100,only for the ATP to announce that their rankings would not get them a place in Doubles Main Draws.
So now we have the Top Singles Players having to play Doubles,when in fact they dont want to,and the Top Ranked Doubles players having to give way to these players.

I guess it will never change,so I might as well get used to it.
But as far as Im concerned the ATP are negelcting the players ranked over 100,and the top 50 players are earning too much,whilst the players ranked above 100 are earning nothing at all.
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Postby FulhamFan » Tue Jun 08, 2004 12:24 pm

I read an article saying the opposite. That tennis was shooting itself in the foot by having knockout draws and it should be round robin like the masters cup. That way we are at least gaurenteed to see agassi for a few rounds instead of totally missing out if he loses the first round.

I thought that the reason why there stars to begin with is that they consistently average 3 wins per tournament.

Oh and steve. I beleive the first rant was about ESPN
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Postby CrazyDiamond » Tue Jun 08, 2004 12:39 pm

Interesting article.

If a Pro playing the Challenger circuit wins 3 matches per Tournament....he'll starve. :D ....I guess that would be a "falling star". :wink:

Poor Stella Artois.....Agassi's gone,Dent's gone,Vacek's gone,Rusedski's gone,Ivanisavic is gone,Phillipoussis is gone,.....the only stars left are the one's that had "Bye's". :wink:

Dont underestimate any Pro Player in the Top 150....they can beat anyone on their day.

I love talking Tennis....thanks Steve.
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Postby UNTBOWLER » Tue Jun 08, 2004 1:28 pm

Looking at Queen's it is anyone in Top 900 looking at the kid who be Ivanisevic. :o
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stella artois

Postby shtexas » Wed Jun 09, 2004 9:25 am

The Stella Artois event is a larger draw, so several more lower ranked players are being given the opportunity to compete. Therefore, I don't have a problem with the byes at all. They are simply the result of a larger draw. It would be much worse if the tournament reduced the draw to 32. Don't the events in Indian Wells and Miami have byes because of their larger draws? What about the indoor Masters Series events? I believe they also have byes. Otherwise, those indoor events would be forced to reduce their draw sizes because they don't have enough indoor courts to play a non-bye 64 player draw.
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Re: stella artois

Postby CrazyDiamond » Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:34 am

shtexas wrote:The Stella Artois event is a larger draw, so several more lower ranked players are being given the opportunity to compete. Therefore, I don't have a problem with the byes at all. They are simply the result of a larger draw. It would be much worse if the tournament reduced the draw to 32. Don't the events in Indian Wells and Miami have byes because of their larger draws? What about the indoor Masters Series events? I believe they also have byes. Otherwise, those indoor events would be forced to reduce their draw sizes because they don't have enough indoor courts to play a non-bye 64 player draw.


Im not only complaining about Stella Artois,Im saying that any Tournament that has 10 bye's in the first round is guilty of ignorance.......because 10 lower ranked Pro Players could be getting the opportunity to make some real money,and a chance to win a match aginst a top 50 player.

There simply is no way for a player ranked between 100 and 150 to make money....it's not possible.
So the ATP in my opinion should be looking for ways to improve the earnings of players ranked over 100.......by giving bye's they're not doing that.

IMO Tennis is the hardest most competetive individual sport in the world.
Golf does'nt even come close.......most Pro golfers are 30 pounds overweight,unfit and way too rich..........not so with Tennis.
Tennis players have to be supremely fit just to compete.
However go and take a look at what a Pro Golfer ranked between 100 and 150 in the world earns a year.

Stella Artois only has three courts(I think)......so if this was the case then why did they only start the Singles Qualifying on the Saturday,instead of the Friday.
In the end a couple of players who were doing really well at the Surbiton Challenger,had to play two Qualifying matches at Stella back to back......bad organization....un professional IMO.
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byes

Postby shtexas » Fri Jun 11, 2004 9:32 am

Yes. But, if the Stella Artois event has as few courts as you say, then it has as large a draw as it can handle. The answer may be to have some of the 32 draw events expand to 56 to the extent their facilities can handle it.

By the way, while I am not a golf fan, I do not agree that "most Pro golfers are 30 pounds overweight". Some definitely are, but not most.
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Re: byes

Postby CrazyDiamond » Fri Jun 11, 2004 9:58 am

shtexas wrote:
By the way, while I am not a golf fan, I do not agree that "most Pro golfers are 30 pounds overweight". Some definitely are, but not most.


Let's put it this way........you dont have to be an athlete to win a Major Golf Tournament.

Even my man Ernie Els is a couple of pounds overweight....when Ernie was a youngster I watched him drop a couple of pints of South African beer many times.....but I still love him. ;)

I still reckon the majority of the Top Golf players could'nt last a couple of games on a Tennis court....they'd be carried off on a stretcher for sure. :D
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Postby Andrew_Derer » Sat Jul 03, 2004 4:55 am

Did you get a reply?
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Postby CrazyDiamond » Sat Jul 03, 2004 11:58 am

I've never recieved a reply from any Tennis Tournament ......they ignore us fans. :D

I did recieve a reply once from the US Open Tournament referee...Brain Early......we had a good discussion.
He concluded to me that no player over 25 years old had broken into the ATP top 100......besides Vince Spadea,but he had done it the first time when he was younger than 25.
I last spoke to Brian 2 years ago......Im watching a player right now who is going to break into the Top 100 very shortly.....he's 28 years old.......then I'll mail him again and tell him about it. :D
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Doubles

Postby Athol » Sat Jul 03, 2004 2:27 pm

"Look at the Doubles situation. It took some players years to get their Doubles Rankings into the Top 100,only for the ATP to announce that their rankings would not get them a place in Doubles Main Draws....But as far as Im concerned the ATP are negelcting the players ranked over 100,and the top 50 players are earning too much,whilst the players ranked above 100 are earning nothing at all."

Quite correct, got one ex-pro aged around mid-twenties playing at our club...he stopped playing the doubles circuit precisely because of this...now studying for a business degree while coaching on the side.
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Postby CrazyDiamond » Sat Jul 03, 2004 3:03 pm

Hey Athol,how you doing,good to talk to a fellow SAfrican.

My nephew,used to play Doubles with Paul Rosner.....their ranking was good enough to get them into most Tourneys including the Slams,and then the ATP changed the rules.
I never saw Paul Rosner again after the rule change,he must have retired.....my nephew then started concerntrating on Singles....luckily he's done pretty well.

Who you talking about in your post.?
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Postby R. Jayakrishnan » Sat Jul 03, 2004 7:10 pm

CrazyDiamond: The ATP referee was defintiely wrong on that. Wayne Arthurs was nowhere near top-100 before he was 26. Cracked top-100 when he was 27 if I remember c orrectly. He is now 33 and has had a pretty long career in the top-100 too (also top-15 in doubles for quite some time too). I respect the guy for what he has done.

I think there are other cases too, but certainly very rare. Normally you would get inside top-100 by 25. Does not mean you can't do it afterwards, but you need to have tremendous drive and generally it will have to be a player who did not play much before 22. Afer about 4-5 years in the top-500 or top-350, if you don't come to top-100, chances are that you probably never will.

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Postby R. Jayakrishnan » Sat Jul 03, 2004 7:15 pm

Well, I can't believe I forgot the case of the player that follow most closely. Leander Paes. He cracked top-100 for the first time when he was 25 and 3 months. He stayed in the top-150 range for almost 3-4 years before beating Pete Sampras one week and getting into top-100 to #73. Stayed there for about 6 months and never really played much singles after that. Paes is a strange case though. Wimbledon and USO junior champion, Olympics singles bronze medalist and the winningest active Davis Cup player who would still beat pretty much anybody under top-75 in Davis Cup.....

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Postby FulhamFan » Sat Jul 03, 2004 11:46 pm

I think antony dupuis didn't play tennis till late in life. I think he was 27 when he cracked the top hundred and he just recently won a tournament.
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stella

Postby fschallenger » Thu Aug 26, 2004 3:53 pm

i agree totaly about the 8 byes , putting 8 brits in would be good 4 crowds on day 1 but it is likely they would be out on day 2 ,wildcards are brits only chance to shine and earn a payday.but in fairness to the stella organizers its only once a year they do need to make a profit.
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